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	<title>Comments on: Li-Young Lee &#8211; Nativity</title>
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	<link>http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/2012/12/17/li-young-lee-nativity-2/</link>
	<description>Sacred Poetry from Around the World</description>
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		<title>By: ebrahim</title>
		<link>http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/2012/12/17/li-young-lee-nativity-2/#comment-86778</link>
		<dc:creator>ebrahim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Dec 2012 09:07:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/?p=2368#comment-86778</guid>
		<description>dear peg, in the spirit of truth, which is after all in being frank an honest, i implore you to to meditate on these words said by a saint, &quot;your existence is a great wrong that cannot be measured.&quot; this includes positive as well as negative existence. perhaps if you forego dimensions you might find of yourself greater than what is inexpressible. i only say this out of care and concern as we each are guardians over the other and perhaps are able to shed a light on an affair looking from outside of it. it is said that words are the expressions of the soul without which expressions, states would remain hidden and so possible cure not revealed. the whole body of a person is an &#039;i&#039;, and i is an expression of the truth even when falsely expressed by the tongue of man. 

love sincerely</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dear peg, in the spirit of truth, which is after all in being frank an honest, i implore you to to meditate on these words said by a saint, &#8220;your existence is a great wrong that cannot be measured.&#8221; this includes positive as well as negative existence. perhaps if you forego dimensions you might find of yourself greater than what is inexpressible. i only say this out of care and concern as we each are guardians over the other and perhaps are able to shed a light on an affair looking from outside of it. it is said that words are the expressions of the soul without which expressions, states would remain hidden and so possible cure not revealed. the whole body of a person is an &#8216;i&#8217;, and i is an expression of the truth even when falsely expressed by the tongue of man. </p>
<p>love sincerely</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Peg</title>
		<link>http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/2012/12/17/li-young-lee-nativity-2/#comment-86675</link>
		<dc:creator>Peg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Dec 2012 16:13:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/?p=2368#comment-86675</guid>
		<description>This poem is so appropriate for me. I am asking myself if I have entered my heart far enough, deep enough. 

each must make a safe place of his heart,
 before so strange and wild a guest
 as God approaches

This section resonated with me instantly, mostly because I could understand it first. The poem is such a sad and somber tone to it. It doesn&#039;t feel like this young man feels God&#039;s presence very often or that God comes and goes, or maybe its that this young man feels like he is the one doing the reaching for God 


every reaching-out-to overreaches,

just to remind himself
 out of what little earth and duration,
 out of what immense good-bye

that God gets to sit back and watch his struggles without God reaching out toward the young man. 

Going deeper into my own process, I believe that the lines where God as visiter is an errant longing of nostalgia to the past untruth we&#039;ve been told by some world religions. It is sometimes easy for my mind to fall back into the untruth because it has endlessly looped in my mind from years and years of entrenchment. It removes me from responsibility and a slave to someone or something else, disempowering me into a helpless child of my past who was taught by those who did not know and by priests who did not tell the Truth. Once the truth is known, then being a helpless child at the mercy of the powers of earth is no longer an issue. One is always connected to the earth and can know when there is an earthquake coming or tornado. One can move to a safer place or work with the earth or weather to lessen the effects so no one is harmed.

I understand now that God is always with me and I in God. We are never separated by my movements or the planet&#039;s. Whether Jesus was born in an actual manger, I do not know. I do know that the Christ light is within my heart always. It was dimmed for awhile, because of all the false light structures, false myths. The movement from slave to sovereign is the alchemical process to reach the full power of the Christ light. I did not have to go to an intermediary to speak to God, sister, brother or priest. I did have to allow the tension of duality, light and dark, to bring to my awareness to all the things like fear, hatred, pain, hurt, jealousy, pride, guilt, etc. in order for them to all be healed through spiritual alchemy.

Have I gone into my heart far enough, deep enough? Maybe the better question is: Do I feel safe enough to enter my own heart? Have I built a manger that is soft, safe, and warm enough for my soul?

Thank you Ivan for your courage in sharing your thoughts. I hope my thoughts are equally as benefitial to you as yours are to me.

Love and light, Peg

PS   In my comments, Ivan, I do try to be mindful of the reader and how he/she will respond, be hurt by what I say. At times though, I do feel like something has to be said no matter if it will challenge another&#039;s belief system. As much as I may hold another&#039;s feet to the fire, I am holding my feet to the fire and probably longer than I do others. I used to love language more than anything. I feel differently now though. Language is a poor form of communication and one that is now, I believe for me, is in its proper place. Love/light, for which there is no word for, love is an aspect of light, is the best form of communication but has limited connection to language. There is much more going on with language than what I was taught in English class. For instance, is my response coming from love or from a place of wanting to cause someone else pain. I would never purposefully cause someone hurt and pain. However, if by accident (not intentioned) I do, I would want to know so I could apologize and/or explain further what I meant by my writings as language alone cannot fully capture at times the energy behind the physical manifestation of language.

For example, the feminine has been so repressed within our culture and language that in order for all of us to break out of the stagnant energy of that sometimes more direct language needs to be used to wake folks up to word choice. Our apathy to engage our minds to overcome this is a hindrance. I am reminded occassionally of this in my speaking with others.

I appreciate your insistance on the spiritual alchemical process throughout your writings and is to be commended. This helps my mind to remain out of its spiritual stagnation. Maybe this is selfish by all the work I have done, kundalini I endured, the subsequent illness as my body had to adapt to the higher light flooding my body and brain, I do not desire to fall back now to a lower brain functioning.

Again, thank you. I do read through all of your work and allow it to strike up an interal conversation. Although I do believe that in the future we will know that our inner conversations we have with others is actually happening within our consciousness field. I also bought your book and am currently enjoying your poetry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This poem is so appropriate for me. I am asking myself if I have entered my heart far enough, deep enough. </p>
<p>each must make a safe place of his heart,<br />
 before so strange and wild a guest<br />
 as God approaches</p>
<p>This section resonated with me instantly, mostly because I could understand it first. The poem is such a sad and somber tone to it. It doesn&#8217;t feel like this young man feels God&#8217;s presence very often or that God comes and goes, or maybe its that this young man feels like he is the one doing the reaching for God </p>
<p>every reaching-out-to overreaches,</p>
<p>just to remind himself<br />
 out of what little earth and duration,<br />
 out of what immense good-bye</p>
<p>that God gets to sit back and watch his struggles without God reaching out toward the young man. </p>
<p>Going deeper into my own process, I believe that the lines where God as visiter is an errant longing of nostalgia to the past untruth we&#8217;ve been told by some world religions. It is sometimes easy for my mind to fall back into the untruth because it has endlessly looped in my mind from years and years of entrenchment. It removes me from responsibility and a slave to someone or something else, disempowering me into a helpless child of my past who was taught by those who did not know and by priests who did not tell the Truth. Once the truth is known, then being a helpless child at the mercy of the powers of earth is no longer an issue. One is always connected to the earth and can know when there is an earthquake coming or tornado. One can move to a safer place or work with the earth or weather to lessen the effects so no one is harmed.</p>
<p>I understand now that God is always with me and I in God. We are never separated by my movements or the planet&#8217;s. Whether Jesus was born in an actual manger, I do not know. I do know that the Christ light is within my heart always. It was dimmed for awhile, because of all the false light structures, false myths. The movement from slave to sovereign is the alchemical process to reach the full power of the Christ light. I did not have to go to an intermediary to speak to God, sister, brother or priest. I did have to allow the tension of duality, light and dark, to bring to my awareness to all the things like fear, hatred, pain, hurt, jealousy, pride, guilt, etc. in order for them to all be healed through spiritual alchemy.</p>
<p>Have I gone into my heart far enough, deep enough? Maybe the better question is: Do I feel safe enough to enter my own heart? Have I built a manger that is soft, safe, and warm enough for my soul?</p>
<p>Thank you Ivan for your courage in sharing your thoughts. I hope my thoughts are equally as benefitial to you as yours are to me.</p>
<p>Love and light, Peg</p>
<p>PS   In my comments, Ivan, I do try to be mindful of the reader and how he/she will respond, be hurt by what I say. At times though, I do feel like something has to be said no matter if it will challenge another&#8217;s belief system. As much as I may hold another&#8217;s feet to the fire, I am holding my feet to the fire and probably longer than I do others. I used to love language more than anything. I feel differently now though. Language is a poor form of communication and one that is now, I believe for me, is in its proper place. Love/light, for which there is no word for, love is an aspect of light, is the best form of communication but has limited connection to language. There is much more going on with language than what I was taught in English class. For instance, is my response coming from love or from a place of wanting to cause someone else pain. I would never purposefully cause someone hurt and pain. However, if by accident (not intentioned) I do, I would want to know so I could apologize and/or explain further what I meant by my writings as language alone cannot fully capture at times the energy behind the physical manifestation of language.</p>
<p>For example, the feminine has been so repressed within our culture and language that in order for all of us to break out of the stagnant energy of that sometimes more direct language needs to be used to wake folks up to word choice. Our apathy to engage our minds to overcome this is a hindrance. I am reminded occassionally of this in my speaking with others.</p>
<p>I appreciate your insistance on the spiritual alchemical process throughout your writings and is to be commended. This helps my mind to remain out of its spiritual stagnation. Maybe this is selfish by all the work I have done, kundalini I endured, the subsequent illness as my body had to adapt to the higher light flooding my body and brain, I do not desire to fall back now to a lower brain functioning.</p>
<p>Again, thank you. I do read through all of your work and allow it to strike up an interal conversation. Although I do believe that in the future we will know that our inner conversations we have with others is actually happening within our consciousness field. I also bought your book and am currently enjoying your poetry.</p>
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		<title>By: Therese Monaghan O.P.</title>
		<link>http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/2012/12/17/li-young-lee-nativity-2/#comment-86655</link>
		<dc:creator>Therese Monaghan O.P.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Dec 2012 13:38:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/?p=2368#comment-86655</guid>
		<description>Your thoughts confirmed my glimpse of this beautiful poem--Nativity- which deepens on each reading...  thank you.
I am happy to be on this mailing list.
              Blessings as we grow to know the world within the World.
                         Therese</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your thoughts confirmed my glimpse of this beautiful poem&#8211;Nativity- which deepens on each reading&#8230;  thank you.<br />
I am happy to be on this mailing list.<br />
              Blessings as we grow to know the world within the World.<br />
                         Therese</p>
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		<title>By: rena navon</title>
		<link>http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/2012/12/17/li-young-lee-nativity-2/#comment-86607</link>
		<dc:creator>rena navon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Dec 2012 06:29:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/?p=2368#comment-86607</guid>
		<description>Returning to Ivan&#039;s message, I learned the author, as did I, lived in Pennsylvania and studied at the U. of Pittsburgh.  What I did because of geography, he did out of choice and verifies my fortunate beginnings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Returning to Ivan&#8217;s message, I learned the author, as did I, lived in Pennsylvania and studied at the U. of Pittsburgh.  What I did because of geography, he did out of choice and verifies my fortunate beginnings.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: rena navon</title>
		<link>http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/2012/12/17/li-young-lee-nativity-2/#comment-86606</link>
		<dc:creator>rena navon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Dec 2012 06:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/?p=2368#comment-86606</guid>
		<description>I will follow Jim&#039;s startling remark with another than begins in the ducts rather than the head.  Reading this poem brought a tear to my eye and a shiver in the arms working these cold, morning computer buttons.  I am in awe of the simple and in love with childhood that precedes our unprotected lives we have to live each of us alone.  

A lovely way to begin a lonely day.  Rena</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I will follow Jim&#8217;s startling remark with another than begins in the ducts rather than the head.  Reading this poem brought a tear to my eye and a shiver in the arms working these cold, morning computer buttons.  I am in awe of the simple and in love with childhood that precedes our unprotected lives we have to live each of us alone.  </p>
<p>A lovely way to begin a lonely day.  Rena</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: bharati</title>
		<link>http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/2012/12/17/li-young-lee-nativity-2/#comment-86605</link>
		<dc:creator>bharati</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Dec 2012 06:24:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/?p=2368#comment-86605</guid>
		<description>Poems give the reader as much as the read-er is read-y for. 
What a poem pours into me depends on how much I as the reader open up.
We &#039;poetry chaikhanis&#039; love, and wait for, and are inspired by Ivan&#039;s deep meditative musings so lucidly and generously shared with us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Poems give the reader as much as the read-er is read-y for.<br />
What a poem pours into me depends on how much I as the reader open up.<br />
We &#8216;poetry chaikhanis&#8217; love, and wait for, and are inspired by Ivan&#8217;s deep meditative musings so lucidly and generously shared with us.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: jim carlin</title>
		<link>http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/2012/12/17/li-young-lee-nativity-2/#comment-86569</link>
		<dc:creator>jim carlin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Dec 2012 21:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.poetry-chaikhana.com/blog/?p=2368#comment-86569</guid>
		<description>flower in the crannied wall-tennison
the first poem my dad read to me as he 
emerged from a 2 1/2 yr psychotic break
started the real questioning</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>flower in the crannied wall-tennison<br />
the first poem my dad read to me as he<br />
emerged from a 2 1/2 yr psychotic break<br />
started the real questioning</p>
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